Well-Known Member
Everyone here needs to remember that we are not alone. There are obviously more guests than members here, folks who stumble in and read these venomous postings and then leave. I have done my best to stay out of these frays, of course I'm no longer the Croton expert I thought I was, so there's no reason for me to jump into a fight when I don't have the tools or the rules. But for those of you who thrive on this sort of confrontation, it is in the best interest of the forum and the Croton Society that you practice some level of civility for the public.

(Sorry, Dean, I know this is your territory, but I just got an email from someone who I sent to this site and he couldn't believe what he read. Said he'd never come back again, as a matter of fact.)

Try to remember, these are just plants we're discussing here and not the political future of the world.
I also recieved Emails not so much on The Heated Debates but on how the Dr. Frank Browns book is being handled. Many people only believe that Franks Book is what it is no errors. And when the avid croton collector just changes names and disputes whats is Black and White kinda makes some people wonder.

Debates are good, Its part of being a American freedom to express, speech and so on. I have to agree with Dean Personal attacks are not accepted. If I have done that again I apologize. I do say lots of things but mostly in jest, For many people I seen Crotons are a obsession, Cant tell them right from wrong. Heated arguments come to be, Next thing you know friendships are lost.

At the end of the day there still Crotons and grow like weeds in South Florida, There is more than enough for everyone. Ill be more than happy to tell people where there at for cuttings. Also a simple sure way of building a simple Mist house of your own. With 95% survival rate. :)
(Sorry, Dean, I know this is your territory, but I just got an email from someone who I sent to this site and he couldn't believe what he read. Said he'd never come back again, as a matter of fact.)

Not really Ricky. No need for apologies. I do not look at this as "my" forum, or my territory. This is really your forum, and is meant to help share knowledge and awareness.

But I have had some experience in trying to manage the many personalities that come to a forum open and available to the entire world. It is a unique venue. And like the worldwide stage, not everyone agrees. And not everyone handles disagreements the same way. Some are diplomatic, and some strap on bombs.

There are two ways forums seem to go. One is a free for all that eventually deteriorates into vitriolic nonsense, of no use to anyone. And the other is a sanitized overly censored place lacking in passion or excitement. There is a middle ground, and that is what I attempt to negotiate.

I too have received several private messages. And I have tried to answer them and explain my thinking. So let me remind everyone of a few things, and ask that everyone understand that like the real world not everyone will ever see eye to eye with any decision I arrive at. So just as we have to tolerate less than what we would like the real world to be, we have to be tolerant and do the same here.

Just remember that we do share a common interest. And it is good that we are passionate about it. Just like in the palm world (where I spend most of my time) I am amazed how heated a disagreement about an ID can become - even among professional botanists. So we are not alone.

But I have to ask two things to make this work without resorted to the bland overly censored forum I wish to avoid.

1) I will not tolerate any more personal attacks. There are ways to disagree without making it personal. If in doubt, then don't post it - period. I will suspend anyone who can't comply, with a ban for repeat offenders.

2) Get a tougher skin. Don't be so sensitive. Don't expect everyone to agree with you and have manners they learned in charm school. For some reason, statements always seem harsher when written down. I am sure if all of us were at a croton get together at a nice garden with a few cold beverages we would manage to have a very pleasant afternoon - and easily work out any differences with some joking and a smile. That is much harder to do here. So realize that and accept it as a limitation, and don't take every written word so seriously.

Dave has apologized here and to me in a manner I will take as sincere. So with everyone's help, let's not antagonize one another and remember what it is we are trying to do here.
I agree that debates are good,most of crotonguru arguments have had some merit.It is only when he started attacking personally that I felt he stepped over the line.
Ask yourself how many of us are are on the fringe because of one individual Dean.
Personally, I'm tired of the unending debate about names. The spelling and lack of punctuation is about to make me lose my mind. No joke. The dynamics have changed for the worst. Let's go back to our happy place.